Rama Sita in Vedas A Contradiction?


Sometimes one comes across references in the Ithihasa and Puranas , when related to the Vedas there is confusion.

Rama and Sita. image.jpg Rama and Sita.

The Vedas,the Scripture of the Hindus, are accepted as Apaurusheya, not man-made and timeless, are undoubtedly the earliest works of Sanatana Dharma, and the Vedas , especially the Rig Veda is considered to be first literature of Mankind.dated conservatively at 5000 BC.

The Ithihasas Ramayana and Mahabharata come later.

One comes across references to Rama and Sita in the Ramayana.

References to Rama in Ramayana.

“14 This to Duḥśīma Pṛthavāna have I sung, to Vena, Rama, to the nobles, and the King.
They yoked five hundred, and their love of us was famed upon their way.
15 Besides, they showed us seven-and-seventy horses here.
Tānva at once displayed his gift, Pārthya at once displayed his gift; and straightway Māyava showed his.” XCIII Visvedevas.

Vena is the ancestor of Rama.

In the absence of Dasaratha reference, some dispute the name Rama as the Rama of Ramayana.

There is an interesting  note found in the Bala Kanda of Ramayana.

Valmiki wrote that he wrote the Ramayana to expound The Vedas.

“kushiilavau tu dharmaGYau raajaputrau yashasvinau |
bhraatarau svarasampannau dadarsha aashramavaasinau ||
sa tu medhaavinau dR^ishhTvaa vedeShu pariniShThitau |
vedopabR^ihmaNaarthaaya taavagraahayata prabhuh ||
kaavyaM raamaayaNaM kR^itsnaM siitaayaashcharitaM mahat.h|
paulastya vadhamityeva chakaara charitavrataH||

(vAlmIki-rAmAyaNa–bAlakANDa 1.4.5-7)

The princes, the brothers, Kusha and Lava, were knowledgeable about Dharma and were glorious. Their voices were melodious and they lived in the hermitage of (vAlmIki). He (vAlmIki), established in good deeds, observed those two extremely intelligent (princes), skilled in the Vedas, and for the sake of expounding the Vedas, he composed and made them study the poem sampUrNa-rAmAyaNa (the entire rAmAyaNa) (containing) the great story of sItA and the slaying of rAvaNa.

These verses from the vAlmIki-rAmAyaNa clearly show that the sage vAlmIki composed the rAmAyaNa to expound the meaning of the Vedas…

Sita in the Vedas.

Auspicious Sita, come thou near;We venerate and worship thee
That thou mayst bless and prosper us
And bring us fruits abundantly.

-Rig veda 4.57

In Harivansha Sita has been invoked as one of the names of goddess Arya:

O goddess, you are the altar’s center in the sacrifice,
The priest’s fee
Sita to those who hold the plough
And Earth to all living being.

The Kausik-sutra and the Paraskara-sutra associate her repeatedly as the wife of Parjanya (a god associated with rains) and Indra.[4]

Sita is known by many epithets. She is called Jānaki as the daughter of Janaka and Maithili as the princess of Mithila.[5] As the wife of Rama, she is called Ramā. Her father Janaka had earned the sobriquet Videha due to his ability to transcend body consciousness; Sita is therefore also known as Vaidehi.

Is this not an Anachronism?

How can the Vedas mention Rama and Sita who came later?

The Ramayana mention that Rama was adorned with Upaveeda and the Upanayana ceremony was performed according the Vedic procedure.

Sita Rama Marriage was performed according to Vedic rites.

Why this contradiction?

The explanation for Rama being found Rama in Vedas.

10.111.07 sacanta yad uShasaH sooryeNa citrAm asya ketavo rAm avindan |
10.111.07 A yan nakShatraM dadRushe divo na punar yato nakir addhA nu veda ||(Rig Veda)

pra tadduHshIme pR^ithavAne vene pra rAme vochamasure maghavatsu |
ye yuktvAya pa.ncha shatAsmayu pathA vishrAvyeshhAm.h ||9Rig Veda 10.93.14),

In yajnas of wealthy kings such as duHshIma, pR^ithavAna, vena, and the powerful rAma, I utter hymns to the gods who travel by 500 chariots drawn by horses in the world of the gods, and who are fond of us (humans).

1.’Since rAmAyaNa is based on the Vedas, there must be mantras in the Vedas that correspond to the immortal story of rAma. It is with this objective that nIlakaNTha, the great commentator on the mahAbhArata, has presented, with his own wonderful commentary, the mantra-rAmAyaNa. The mantra-rAmAyaNa is a compilation of Riks from the R^ig Veda that narrate the story of rAma or the rAmAyaNa.”

2.As I have posted earlier the Vedas were not grasped in one shot.

They were grasped by different Rishis at different times.

Hence the reference to  Rama in the Ramayana could have been included in the later revelations, while a portion of the Vedas were in existence before Rama, which Rama followed.

Reference of Sita in Ramayana.

1. If one were to look at the etymology of the word Sita, it means Furrow, indicating that Sita was found while using furrowing.

As such she was considered to be daughter of Earth.

As Sita was found while using the Furrow, she might have been given the name Sita.

The name given to her was Janaki, daughter of Janaka..

This practice is called Thaddidhaantam, that of linking the the name of the offspring to father.

Thus Rama is also called Dasarathy.

The other explanation for Sita being mentioned in the Vedas is the same as stated for Rama.

Citation.

https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2014/08/07/ramayana-in-the-rig-veda/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sita#Legend

Cholas Descended From Rama’s Dynasty Inscriptions


I have written an article  that the First Chola King  was from the Solar Dynasty of Ikshvaku the ancestor of Rama.

Rama with Kodanda,Bow.jpg
Lord Rama

In another article I mentioned that Lord Rama,s ancestor Satyavrata Manu migrated from the South because of a Tsunami to Ayodhya , whose son Ikshvaku founded the Ikshvaku Dynasty, to which Lord Rama belongs.

Tanjore Big Temple.imae.jpg
Thanjavur Big Temple

Some researches show that the  facts mentioned are correct and they corroborate the fact that the Cholas indeed were the descendants of the Solar Dynasty of Lord Rama.

 

“Cholas claimed their descent from Sun and solar race kings ( Surya vamsis). Cholas worshipped Sun and built several Sun Temples. Konark Sun Temple was built in Orissa by Chola prince who was daughter of Rajaraja and wife of Vimaladitya. One Mudiraj ancestor Dharma Choda chari was said to belong to solar race. Chola- Mutharayar research center concluded that Cholas and Mutharayars belonged to one family tree. Some of the chola surnames among the Mutharayars of Tamilnadu are as given below :Cholamutharayar, Cholan, Cholavalavan, Cholavallakamayar, Killirayar,Killivazhavan,Karikalarayar,Valavan,Valavar. The Cholas claimed their descendancy from Manu, Ikshvaku, Mandhata, Mucukunda and Sibi. A prominent warrior race, cholas are central to many ancient tamil literary works, which describe them as benevolent, courageous and just. They were supposed to have descended from sun and thus were scions of the legendary royal solar dynasty, heirs to a tradition begun centuries ago. Many Chola kings took names and titles ‘sibi’ to probably acknowledge their descent from that legendary king who is celebrated as a paragon of justice. Medieval chola kings took titles like ‘Parakesarin’ and ‘Rajakesarin’ remembering their remote ancestors of that same illustrious lineage who were supposed to have lived centuries and even millenniums before them. The chola country is mentioned by Greek chroniclers and merchants, a more detailed description is provided in works of Ptolemy a Roman trader of 1st century A.D. The recent excavations following tsunami of 2004 has helped throw more light into poompuhar,(Kaveryppattanam) the capital city of early cholas. Evidently, poompuhar was an important port city in the ancient world. It was a place from which traders set sail to far east. Among the greatest of early chola kings was karikala, who according to various tamil literary sources during first century A.D defeated all his southern neighbors. He is also credited with building efficient irrigational systems and canals. The fact that he was benevolent is brought out by a poem which was written on his death. Kampan composed his poem (Tamil Kamba Ramayana) during the reign of the largest and most powerful Tamil kingdom, the imperial Cholas. Sholas might have supported this literature keeping in view of their descendancy to solar race to which Srirama belonged. Under the umbrella of that expanding empire, which claimed victories from the Ganga to Sumatra, Rama shrines were built, extensive sets of Ramayana reliefs were carved along the base of several temples, and temples supported recitations of the Rama story. Chola monarchs also bore Rama’s name in their imperial titles, and apparently one raja perceived parallels between his conquest and Rama’s when he erected icons to the epic hero to celebrate a victory over the Sinhala kings of Lanka. One temple inscription goes so far as to suggest the story of Rama as an origin myth for the Cholas, which was a solar dynasty like Rama’s. The Cholas belonged to the Solar and the Chalukyas to the Lunar race. The former were generally Saivas and the latter were Vaishnavas as they had the boar for their crest. Besides, the Chalukyas were also patrons of the Jainas. Cholas connection to solar race kings consolidated through Rangavimana : Manu’s son Ikshwaku cherished the desire of possessing the Ranga Vimanam for the benefit of the people on earth. He consulted his family preceptor, Vasishtha (priest of the Surya vamsha), who advised him to start penance uttering the sacred Ashtakshara Mantra. Accordingly, Ikshwaku started a severe penance which puzzled even the devas, foreboding evil days for them. They attempted to spoil the penance by deputing Maninatha and the celestial nymphs to distract his attention. Indra took the lead in this affair and did not even hesitate to send the Vajraayudha (lightning weapon) to foil the penance. But all failed in their attempts. In disappointment, they prayed to Brahma, to save them from the baffling catastrophe. Brahma on his part approached Ranganatha for advice. Ranganatha consoled Brahma by expressing his desire to go to Ayodhya where he would be worshipped by the descendant of the Solar dynasty for four yugas, and at the end of the fourth yuga he would go to the kingdom of the Cholas in the South, on the banks of the Kaveri, where he would stay for 700 years. At the end, of this period he would return to Brahmaloka. Brahma was directed to part with the Ranga Vimanam to Ikshwaku. Cholas were Kolis : One Gandaraditya in one of the hymns calls himself ‘king of Kori’ and ‘lord of Tanjai’. This means that he belonged to the Chola royal family as per historians. Koris and Kolis are one and the same people. Mudiraj and Muthuraj people are said to be kolis of South India. Koris <=> kolis => Kolas => Colas => CholasGangaikonda Chola : According to the Kalingattu-Parani, Kulottunga’s father belonged to the lunar race, and his mother was the daughter of Gangaikonda-Chola .

‘. One other ancestor of Sri Rama, Musu Kunthan, is none other than the Musu Kuntha Chola in ancient Tamil history. This Musu Kunthan’s reign was during the second Tamil Sangam age 4800-2800 BC.’

Citation.

http://mutharayan.blogspot.in/2013/05/king-karkala-cholan.html

 

http://www.veda.harekrsna.cz/connections/Americas.php#7

Who Saw Rama As Vishnu In Physical Form, Ramayana


Who saw Lord Rama as Vishnu Himself in Human Form?

There are references in The Ramayana of people recognizing Rama as Vishnu.

Hanuman, Shiva and Rama.Image.jpg
Hanuman, Shiva and Rama.

Viswamitra makes the first mention of this when he tells Dasaratha, while taking Rama with him that Dasaratha did not realize who Rama was, implying he knew Rama was Vishnu , but he did not express it openly.

The next instance is when Parashurama’s Astra fails, He addresses Rama as an Incarnation of Vishnu.

Then Ravana realizes Rama was none other than Vishnu, the Pranava Swaroopa, when Ravana’s Sakthi Ayudha fails.

Later Vibhishana knew Rama was Vishnu.

But it is Hanuman who sees Rama as Vishnu by looking at Rama the first instance, as Vishnu .

That too in Vishnu in His Physical form.

Valmiki talks of this.

aayataaH cha suvR^ittaaH cha baahavaH parighopamaaH || 4-3-14
sarva bhuuShaNa bhuuShaarhaaH kim artham na vibhuuShitaaH |

14b, 15a. aayataaH su vR^ittaaH baahavaH= lengthy, spherical, too, are arms; parighaH upamaH= clubs, in similarity; sarva bhuuSaNa bhuuSa arhaaH= for all kinds of, ornaments, decor-worthy; kim artham= for what, reason; na vibhuuSitaaH= not decorated.

“Also lengthy are your hands, and spherical are your shoulders similar to clubs… they are worthy for decoration with every kind of ornament, for what reason they are undecorated… [4-3-14b, 15a]

Here in the verse plural number is used for hands, aayataaH, baahavaH, parighaaH, whereas so far, dual number, dvivachana is used to describe any two. The ancient commentators take this as many hands, more than two, as opposite to other dual numbered wording. For this it is said that since Lakshmana is a right hand to Rama, Hanuma sees a three-handed god in Rama. But Hanuma is talking to both Rama and Lakshmana; there shall be two deities with two hands each. The accepted phenomenon is that, Hanuma as a true devotee has seen the fourhanded Vishnu in Rama. This is according to Govindaraja. Next, the arms of Rama are of protective nature to the friendly ones. aayaataaH, lengthily ones – they can be stretched to any extent, and on the other hand, anything can depend on them, as in yopaam aayatanam veda… and this su vrittaaH, round like the serpent’s hoods, or body builder’s clubs, is to tell that no one can near them. Thus, the spherical universe can depend on the spherical shoulders of Rama. Thus Hanuma is reminding Rama of his wild-boar incarnation where the whole world is lifted on his snout from waters. The word parighaH, is to say that those spherical shoulders can remove difficulties of those who adore them. The parighaH in simple terms means, clubs, bludgeon, or ancient dumbbell unlike the present day dumbbells of gym, but the word is deciphered to be pari gha fully, removing, or fully, falling to one’s lot. That is, here these shoulders are mighty to eliminate Vali and these hands if shook by Sugreeva in friendship, Sugreeva’s miseries will be removed completely..

In Sanskrit there are different  words for  addressing a Single person(Eka Vachana), two (Dwivachana) and more than two(Bahu Vachana)

Citation.

http://www.valmikiramayan.net/kishkindha/sarga3/kishkindha_3_prose.htm

Ravana Sita Foot Prints Sugreeva Cave Jatayu Rocks


PR Srinivasa Iyengar,, an erudite Scholar in Tamil had written an excellent Book on The History of the Tamils.

He was also a staunch Si Vaishnava.

When he writes on History he divests himself of his beliefs and examines theories and analyses facts.

He had treated Legends associated with Tamil/Tamils and then Epics, Ramayana and Mahabharata on this touchstone of facts.

He strips down the poetic descriptions in The Ramayana ,and arrives at a firm conclusion that The Ramayana did take place.

He took the premise that there a Prince, whose wife was taken away by a King of Lanka and he was defeated by the prince.

The barest fact has been tested and proved historically.

If something is proved historically one should have monuments, records to back up.

There are evidences to prove that the Ramayana was real, Astronomy, Literary   references,monuments.

I have written articles on The Ashoka Vatika,Ravana’s Pushpaka Vimana Runway.Pushpaka Vimana Axle,where Sita was imprisoned, where she took Bath in Lanka.

I am providing a Photo Essay on some of the Historical Remains of the Ramayana.

Please read my detailed posts on each of these topics.

Sita's Footprint,Lepakshi,Image.jpg
Sita’s Footprint,Lepakshi.

 

 

Jatayu Rock,image.jpg
Jatayu Rocks,Jatayu,a huge bird, an associate of Lord Ram, staked his existence attempting to recover Sita (Ram’s wife) from her abductor, the evil spirit ruler Ravana. The rock is belieived to stamp the spot where the mortally wounded Jatayu fell
Rama Foot print, Chitrakoot.Image.jpg
Rama Foot print, Chitrakoot.
Ravana Footprints.image.jpg
Ravana Footprints.
Footprints of Hanuman.image.jpg
Footprints of Hanuman.
Pushpaka Vimana Landing site.image.jpg
When they say “Hanuman set Lanka on fire” what they actually mean is he set fire to certain parts of Raavan’s palace. The ground here is said to be somewhat black which is nothing like the surrounding area. The picture below is from Ussangoda, which according to mythology was the landing strip for Raavan’s Pushpak Vimaan
Where Sita was Kept.Image.jpg
When Raavan brought Sita to Lanka, he first took her to this place called Sita Kotuwa, which is now a tourist spot in Sri Lanka.
Ashoka Vatika.image.jpg
Ashoka Vatika.
Sita's Pond where Sita took bath.image.jpg
Sita’s Pond where Sita took bath
Where Sita Took Agnipariksha.image.jpg
Where Sita Took Agnipariksha.

Citation.

http://www.hinduismworld.org/real-proof-of-ramayan-photo/

http://www.scoopwhoop.com/inothernews/ramayana-actually-happened/

Sita Performed Sraddha Cursed River


The majority held belief is that women should not perform Sandhyavandana and death Rites.

I differ from this view.

Phalgu River, cursed by Sita.Image.jpg
Phalgu River.

Great Rishis have been women, like Maiteyi,Gargi,Kathyayani.

These Rishis have composed Veda Sutras, Sukthas.

Vedic wisdom is encapsulated in myriad hymns and 27 women-seers emerge from them.

 

Ghosha, who has a definite human form. Granddaughter of Dirghatamas and daughter of Kakshivat, both composers of hymns in praise of Ashwins, Ghosha has two entire hymns of the tenth book, each containing 14 verses, assigned to her name. The first eulogizes the Ashwins, the heavenly twins who are also physicians; the second is a personal wish expressing her intimate feelings and desires for married life. Ghosha suffered from an incurable disfiguring disease, probably leprosy, and remained a spinster at her father’s house. Her implorations with the Ashwins, and the devotion of her forefathers towards them made them cure her disease and allow her to experience wedded bliss.

The Rig Veda contains about one thousand hymns, of which about 10 are accredited to Maitreyi, the woman seer and philosopher.

Gargi, the Vedic prophetess and daughter of sage Vachaknu, composed several hymns that questioned the origin of all existence. When King Janak of Videha organized a ‘brahmayajna’, a philosophic congress centered around the fire sacrament, Gargi was one of the eminent participants. She challenged the sage Yajnavalkya with a volley of perturbing questions on the soul or ‘atman’ that confounded the learned man who had till then silenced many an eminent scholar. Her question – “The layer that is above the sky and below the earth, which is described as being situated between the earth and the sky and which is indicated as the symbol of the past, present and future, where is that situated?” – bamboozled even the great Vedic men of letters.

One is expected to have Upaveedha to learn the Vedas.

These women composed Veda Sukthas.

They could not have learnt the Vedas without Upaveedha.

Hence they had to perform Sandhyavanda and other Karmic duties.

I have a detailed article on this.

Now there is Reference in the Ramayana and Garuda Purana that Sita offered Pinda to Dasaratha, her father in law at Gaya.

There is reference to the city of Gaya and the Phalgu in the Ramayana in which it says that Sita had cursed the Phalgu River. There is an interesting story and the mythology states that on account of this curse, the Phalgu lost its water, and the river is simply a vast stretch of sand dunes.According to tradition, in the absence of Rama, his wife Sita offered pinda on its banks to Dasharatha father of Rama.

The story goes that Rama, along with his brothers and Sita, came to Gaya to perform the sacred rites for his father, Dasaratha. When the brothers were bathing in the river, Sita was sitting on the banks, playing with the sand. Suddenly, Dasaratha appeared out of the sand, and asked for the Pindam, saying he was hungry. Sita asked him to wait till his sons returned, so that she could give him the traditional Pindam of rice and til. He refused to wait, asking her to give him pindams made of the sand in her hand.

Having no other option, she gave him the Pindam he desired with five witnesses – the Akshaya Vatam, the Falguni River, a cow, a Tulsi plant and a Brahmin. Soon, Rama returned and started the rituals. In those days apparently, the ancestors would arrive in person to collect their share, and when Dasaratha did not appear, they wondered why. Sita then told them what had happened, but Rama could not believe that his father would accept pindams made of sand. Sita now mentioned her witnesses, and asked them to tell Rama the truth.

Among the five, only the Akshaya Vatam took her side and told the truth, while the others lied, trying to take Rama’s side. In her anger, Sita cursed all of them thus: the Falguni river henceforth would have no water at Gaya; the Cow would no longer be worshipped from the front as all others are- only its backside would be worshipped; there would be no more Tulsi plants at Gaya and the Gaya Brahmins would never be satisfied, they would always be hungry and crave more and more. She then blessed the Akshaya Vatam saying that all who came to Gaya would perform the Pinda pradaanam at the Akshaya Vatam too.

Sri Sita is said to have performed Sandhyavandanam including Dhyaanam and Japam (Vide page 97 of Notes on AyOdhya KhaaNDam of Srimad Vaalmiki Ramayanam by Sri C.R.Srinivasa Iyengar)

View of Kanchi Acharya.

I said that the twice-born must perform sandhyavandana with the well-being of women and other jatis in mind. I also explained why all samskaras are not prescribed for the fourth varna. Now we must consider the question of women, why they do not have such rituals and samskaras.

Even though we perform the punyaha-vacana and namakarana of newborn girls and celebrate their first birthday, we do not conduct their caula and upanayana nor the other samskaras or vows laid down for brahmacarins. Of course, they have the marriage samskara. But in other rites like sacrifices the main part is that of the husband, though she (the wife) has to be by his side. In aupasana alone does a woman have a part in making oblations in the sacred fire.

  1. Why is it so?
  2. The rites performed before a child is born are intended for the birth of a male child (niseka, pumsavana, simanta). Does it mean, as present-day reformers and women’s libbers say, that Hindu women were downgraded and kept in darkness?
  3. What reason did I mention for the fourth varna not having to perform many of the samskaras?

That these were not necessary considering their vocations and the fact that they can work for the welfare of the world without the physical and mental benefits to be derived from the samskaras. If they also spend their time in Vedic learning and in sacrifices, what will happen to their duties? So most of the samskaras are not necessary for them. They reach the desire goal without these rites by carrying out their duties.

“Svakarmana tam abhyarcya siddhim vindati manavah“, so says the Gita. I have spoken to you about this earlier.

Just as society is divided according to occupations and the samskaras are correspondingly different, so too there are differences between men and women in domestic life. Running a household means different types of work, cooking, keeping the house clean, bringing up the children, etc. By nature women can do these chores better than men. If they also take an active part in rituals, what will happen to such work? Each by serving her husband and by looking after her household becomes inwardly pure.

In truth three is no disparity between men and women, nor are women discriminated

against as present-day reformers allege.

Work is divided for the proper maintenance not only of the home but the nation on the whole; and care has been taken not to have any duplication.

There is no intention of lowering the status of any section in this division of labour.

The body, in the case of certain people, is meant to preserve the mantras and there are samskaras which have the purpose of making it worthy of the same.

Why should the same rituals be prescribed for those who do not have such tasks to carry out?

Glassware to be sent by railway parcel is specially taken care of since it is fragile. Even greater care is taken in dispatching kerosene or petrol. If the same precautions are not taken in transporting other goods, does it mean that they are poorly thought of?

Citation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phalgu

http://www.kamakoti.org/hindudharma/part18/chap2.htm

https://thapas.wordpress.com/2012/03/10/women-performing-veda-samskaaras-by-kanchi-mahaswami/